Advice required for Jessie Whippet

[Penel CIMDA moderator]

Hi Mick
How is Jessie now - have you got any further with her diagnosis yet? sounds all very complicated but yes whippets do get Addison's more than other breeds do. 
Thinking of you and hoping for some good news soon - it sounds like Jessie is still in good spirits which is great.

[mickwhippet]

Picking Jessie up tomorrow, snow permitting. She's had/got Salmonellosis which is why she wasn't improving. It seems that the anaemia and polyathritis was a secondary symptom. Her temperature was spiking every hour which only after being under constant attention that it had been recognised – which is why she was having good 'days' and bad days.
She is now down to 15mg of prednisolone, and off the Imurain. They found it from a culture in a urine test. She's had a wide spectrum anti biotic which should hopefully see off the infection – the strain she has is treatable. She had no cases of vomiting or diarrheoa throughout the time she has been ill which are the normal symptoms.
The vets say she looks a mess – lost more weight, shaved (for spinal and joint taps etc) but she should recover in time and is looking quite perky. Vet said she's been a trooper throughout and is very resilient. Fingers crossed.

[goldiepower]

Picking Jessie up tomorrow, snow permitting...
The vets say she looks a mess – lost more weight, shaved (for spinal and joint taps etc) but she should recover in time and is looking quite perky. Vet said she's been a trooper throughout and is very resilient. Fingers crossed.

I hope you get her home today, the main roads seem to be clear so paws crossed. Has she had the spinal and joint taps while she's been at Liverpool?

[Penel CIMDA moderator]

Fingers crossed indeed - is she home now and how is she doing?

do they think it was from raw feeding?

[mickwhippet]

She's back at home and seems much better, just been for a walk with her brothers – the snow whippets (its a foot deep in places here).
The diagnosis is – urine infection with Salmonella, stage 1 chronic kidney disease with protein loss, immune mediated polyarthritis and mild anaemia.
Her blood count is up to 31. She is on 15mg of prednisolone (which we are going to reduce gradually to hopefully none), 2 types of antibiotics for 6 weeks – due to bile infection. Benazepril to reduce protein in urine.
She's had joint taps, spinal taps, x rays, ultrasounds, blood tests, bone marrow biopsy, urine culture, blood culture, faecal culture.
They said to only feed her cooked food and muzzle her when she's out to prevent her killing and scavenging wildlife. She has a liking for rotting grouse carcasses, kills squirrels, rats, mice, rabbits, ducks, chickens, grouse, pheasants, a baby woodpecker and a mole. They said she could have caught Salmonella from bird carcasses, raw diet, animal faeces (which unfortunately she does sometimes eat;^P), bird tables are also known to be a source (all 4 dogs are always polishing off bird seed and fat balls whenever possible).
She has to go back in 7 weeks for updates and to our own vet in 3 weeks for blood test and urine test.
I hope this has been helpful to anyone else – this has been a real conundrum (our own vet is fascinated).
I'll let you know how she gets on, at least she has a good chance and things are moving the right way.

[Penel CIMDA moderator]

It all sounds very very thorough.  Fingers crossed she's on the up now.

My setter caught campylobacter from a stagnant pond once.  Do you know how to train her to wear a muzzle - if you need any help let me know we have a helpsheet on it.  Jan's gifts do good whippet muzzles too - you'll need one better than the plastic coated wire though or she'd be able to snaffle through that.
This one will probably be your best bet
http://www.jansgifts.co.uk/itempp.php?code=ks5&id=182&lang=&type_id=114

[mickwhippet]

Jessie update.
She's down to 5mg of Prednisolone per day and still has 5 weeks of anti biotics to go but she's definitely on the mend.
Gums are much pinker, she's interested, playful and more like the dog we used to have (apart from the shaved areas).
Her thigh muscles have started building up again and she can now jump into the car, onto the bed and the sofa etc,
she's still not running at 30mph but in time i'm sure she will. She prefers her raw diet but we were advised not to feed her raw,
so she's stuck with kibble for the time being.
What's the usual time scale for weaning off the steroids?

[Jo CIMDA]

That's great news about Jessie.  It will take at least 4-6 months to wean a dog off immunosuppressive doses of steroids.

She's done well.

Jo

[patp]

I have just read this thread because of the word Whippet (my Whippet has Addisons). Just wanted to say well done you for sticking by your dog and getting her sorted. I hope you are insured 

[mickwhippet]

Hi,
a worrying update.
After 6 months of good health i'm afraid that Jessie has had a bit of a relapse. Heading towards anaemia again, pale gums, lacking energy etc. She's currently at the vet (been in for 2 days because she was quite dehydrated). Is this normal for a dog to relapse after a period of wellness? She's back on the steroids, prednisolone, zantac, Imurain etc.
regards

[Jo CIMDA]

Hi

I realise how disappointing this must be for you but as I have just written to Maxim, unfortunately relapses are not unusual.

Jessie will have to start immunosuppressive treatment again, but please check out the immunosuppressive drug protocol in the files and check that the protocol your vet is using is similar.  I seem to remember that they were very slow in reducing the steroid last time which. Your vet could contact Liverpool Vet school again for their guidance.

I have just written the following to Mixim and it applies to Jessie too.   

"Many years ago I was in contact with a top Endocrinologist who knew so much about AI diseases.  He taught me a lot, especially about endocrine diseases, but one thing he said has always stuck in my mind.  He told me that if a dog has achieved remission and then relapsed, the dog has definitely encountered a trigger factor again and this has caused the relapse.  So it seems as if Luch has met a trigger for this relapse, but he may not do so again, so be positive and let's hope this is the last relapse." 

Has Jessie recently encountered anything that may have triggered this relapse, such as a vaccine, stressful situation or drugs etc......?

I hope her red cell count isn't too low and you see some good improvement within this week.

Jo

[mickwhippet]

Hi,
thanks for your response.
Yes it is disappointing and we can't get insurance for this condition any more so it's expensive.
She had her booster vaccinations in April and she's been on Benazapril to reduce protein in her urine since she was ill the first time, she's been great for the last 5 months.
Just recently noticed she was withdrawn and had pale gums and then started to refuse her food (which is very unusual) so we know the signs.
Her blood count is currently at 24.
Her gums were grey this morning but have gradually got pinker as the day has gone on.
I'll check on the dosage with the vet on Tuesday.

[vickyb]

Our Sapphy (greyhound) was diagnosed with IMPA in November and is still on immunosuppressants and steroids.
I was told that vaccines were out of the question for the foreeable future - possibly forever.

Hope Jessie improves quickly.

[mickwhippet]

Hi,
I need a bit more advice regarding Jessie Whippet. She recovered from her August relapse in October and was signed off by the vet with a blood count of 48. In November she relapsed again – the vet said we stopped the steroids too soon – we had lost confidence in our vet due to the high doses of preds she was put on – 40mg per day. We started reducing and she got better. After her second relapse she was put on 40mg of preds per day plus Imurain etc – the vet said she needed those high doses to kick start her immune system again. I argued that her blood count wasn't critical – late 20's so should she really be on that amount. We ended up having a bit of a stand off and gave in due to it being our decision the previous time to reduce her preds. In the meantime Jessie looked absolutely dreadful and caught several infections – pustules on her skin – she lost a huge patch of hair on her head etc. She wasn't improving so we asked for a second opinion from Liverpool who seem to think that she may be a carrier of Salmonella? They told our vet to stop the imurain and reduce the preds at a rate of 10mg per 5 days to induce a crash whereupon they would take over. At the moment Jessie is on 5mg of preds per day plus an antibiotic. Her blood count is at 39 and apart from her muscle wastage she is almost back to normal – playing with the others and interested again. We don't really want to induce a crash if it is unnecessary – so what we need to know is how we control the meds from now on?
Thanks in advance.
Mick n Liz and Jessie

[Jo CIMDA]

Hi Mick n Liz and Jessie.

I agree, I wouldn't want to induce a crash when her PCV is 39% and she is well in herself. 

Perhaps your vet could contact Liverpool, or in fact you contact them, and talk to the clinician Jessie is under and explain the situation and say that you are reluctant to lower the drugs any further to induce a crash because she is so well in herself and also her PCV is now 39%.  You could take Jessie to see the consultation and he/she may share your thoughts and allow Jessie remain on 5mg a day for a few weeks, at least, and then start to slowly reduce the dose. 

Very often when a dog reduces to 5mg a day the next stage is to reduce the dose to every other day, but it can be done a different way eg., drop to 4mg a day for a few weeks and then 3mg a day and then go every other day,  and then very gradually reduce the EOD dose or even go to every third day etc....  There are lots of different permutations when the dose is low.

The good news is her bone marrow responds very well to the steroids.  Go with your instinct!

Good luck

Jo